Language.

[skullreken]

I think the over usage of words is more habit than anything else. I tend to end and start allot of my sentences with You know I have a university degree in Chemistry and I am finishing my major in biology this year so I wouldn't consider myself to be under educated

[Lady_Rin]

Let's just say educated >>> uneducated. The point Baki and I were making is one who is educated would normally have a larger vocabulary than an uneducated person. Perhaps you think you say certain words too much but that's probably just you. The saying goes "You are your biggest critic." Now, when I said over usage of 'so' and 'like' and any other word, I was speaking about the ones similar to Paris Hilton who use them in EVERY sentence.

I think the over usage of words is more habit than anything else. I tend to end and start allot of my sentences with You know I have a university degree in Chemistry and I am finishing my major in biology this year so I wouldn't consider myself to be under educated

An education is more than a degree from college or university. I have degrees (3 of them) in Art/Art history, Geology and a teaching degree. That only means that I have had a formal education on the other hand it does not mean I'm educated. The same applies to you Skull and to Rhun who has more formal education than anyone I know. A proper education also means the arts, attending concerts and art shows, the theater and ballet. Additionally therre is music, reading, exploring and a million other things as well. That kind of education shows better vocabulary, clearer thought and little in the way of vulgarities.

People who have poor language skills usually suffer also have problems in the workplace. Best not to let vulgar language and poor habits like "You know.." get in your way.

[134121N]

im very confused with English but im try it and i can but not too much sometime im use dictionary and one language again make me confused this language is Arabic so confused i not too much can it and japan language *terima kasih* (thanx)

[stints]

I don't think the things you listed can make you educated Lady Rin. Perhaps 300 years ago but not in todays time. It makes you more, hmm, what's the proper word, culturally refined. To me, if you can do college mathematics and science, you're educated.

Skull did bring up a good point about habits. They're hard to break. Like Chris' use of certain words, I seriously doubt Skull uses the phrase "you know" in every sentence. Now, if he does, well, the fact that he notices it is a good thing. Probably means he's trying to stop himself (just my assumption, sorry). Actually, I use to do that.

As for the work place, I'll be using "vulgar" language (I put quotes because I myself do not believe they are vulgar). Do I constantly use the "F word" in all instances? No. But when the time is right, I can and will. Lady Rin, the last sentence comes off a bit rude, don't you think?

[Lady_Rin]

im very confused with English but im try it and i can but not too much sometime im use dictionary and one language again make me confused this language is Arabic so confused i not too much can it and japan language *terima kasih* (thanx)

Barin here is your quote corrected for spelling and grammar. Please excuse me but I am a teacher.

I'm very confused by English but I do try. Sometimes I use a dictionary. One language that makes me confused is Arabic.

I'm (I am) not sure what you meant by the sentence below.

so confused i not too much can it and japan language *terima kasih* (thanx)

Does that help? I do hope so.


I'm told that English is one of the hardest languages in the world to learn. Mostly because of it's spelling with words like "To, too and two" I found I had little trouble learnign German and French in school and learning Spanish, the second language, when we moved to Rhun's home. I have problems with Japanese. I am trying to learn it through a language course and while watching Anime.

What amazes me is how good the English is of of most non-English speaking people is. Don't forget the ore you use a language the easier it becomes and that means writing it as well.

I don't think the things you listed can make you educated Lady Rin. Perhaps 300 years ago but not in todays time. It makes you more, hmm, what's the proper word, culturally refined. To me, if you can do college mathematics and science, you're educated.

I don't agree. The best example I can think of that shows a lack of education is George Bush. He went to Yale University and shows his lack of education in his manner of speach and his attitudes towards everything. Another is an attorney I know named Barry. There is no doubt he is a brilliant person, wealthy and sucessful yet you can see that all he really is under all of that is a jock, a sports fanatic. It shows in every aspect of his life. He has been married several times and three of his wives left him because we was a jock. OUrside of sports and work he has no life. Without the cultural refinements like art and music how can you say you are a truly well rounded and education person.

Skull did bring up a good point about habits. They're hard to break. Like Chris' use of certain words, I seriously doubt Skull uses the phrase "you know" in every sentence. Now, if he does, well, the fact that he notices it is a good thing. Probably means he's trying to stop himself (just my assumption, sorry). Actually, I use to do that.

According to a study I read people who use fillers in their language: "Like...", "Ya, know" and "whatever" show a lack of clear critical thinking and often have an inability to communicate effectively, "like, know what I mean".

As for the work place, I'll be using "vulgar" language (I put quotes because I myself do not believe they are vulgar). Do I constantly use the "F word" in all instances? No. But when the time is right, I can and will. Lady Rin, the last sentence comes off a bit rude, don't you think?

You meant this one:

People who have poor language skills usually suffer and have problems in the workplace. Best not to let vulgar language and poor habits (language skills) like "You know." get in your way.

It was poorly written and I corrected it however I still agree with it's intent. Both Rhun and I and work as tour guides. Can you imagine what would happen if we were to even let a single expletive out. I've seen ithappen with other guides. The usual result is suspension or loss of their job. Normally there is no second chance. Using vulgar language not only offensive to many people in is insulting as well. That's just my opinion.

[baki]

@Rin: Tour guides losing their jobs over letting out expletives? Not in Russia. My mother used to work as a tour guide there while getting her university degrees, and she does have stories about that. Unfortunately, some of the stories don't translate very well into English, you have to know Russian expletives, too.

I do agree with your point about Bush lacking education in spite of graduating from Yale, because he uses very folksy language and can't even say 'nuclear' properly. But I also agree with what the others say, having the grades/job/success in life does not equal being educated and refined. But then, what does? Being a walking encyclopedia? This comes at the price of refinement. It's possible to know quite a bit about the world, and still be pretty crude in your behavior.

[stints]

I believe she is equating personality with ones level of education. My personality is "I don't give a...". Sure, if I actually do respect the person, I'll care. I've been called rude, a jerk, lazy, a dork, nerd, geek, know-it-all... All in all, education doesn't change a persons personality and personality doesn't govern ones intellect. It's all about life experiences that do that. And sure, those areas you listed before Lady Rin, one might be moved by them, I myself do enjoy classical music; however, I do not enjoy art shows and as such going would be a waste of my time.

BTW, Bush is actually pretty intelligent. I believe I read his IQ was a little above normal. He just doesn't have good leadership qualities, if any. He is a good person, but was a terribly, awful president.

[chrisd69]

crap what do you expect bush is also from texas.. jeesh everybody there talks funny. i know because of the job i do i have i talk to them.

language is a means for communication without it, we wouldn't be really able to communicate. yes we have colorful expletatives but for the most part that is just what they are. people in todays society have the tendency to use more words and the curse words or whatever in most sentences. it doesn't matter if they are a grade school drop out or some ivy league or oxford graduate. you will find them using those words in society. the only thing you can do is say i do not allow for language like that to be used in my classroom or in my home.

does the bible not say cast not the first stone yest ye be judged? which translated is along the lines don't judge others unless you yourself be judged?

milady rin were these people at your home or were you at their home? if it was the latter then really you don't have to go over there again to talk to them. but in today's society its everywhere now and there really is nothing you can say or do because it is up to those parents to try to stop it. and if its allowed in their house fine so be it.

here is a story of something that happened with me yesterday. i was out with my wife and i stepped in dog crap on the sidewalk in the area we were at. so i dropped 1 jesus F-bomb christ, 2 stupid asses, and one other.. this young religous couple looked over at me and said that i shouldn't use such harsh language because of their children who were about 10 and 12, i told them that yes i can its my first amendment right of the constitution of the usa for free speech and that i am sure they hear those words every day in their school or in the movies they watch! and they went on their way and so did i after that.

[Batou-san]

I dont think I lack in education, and I am still continuing it...
and when i explain something to people I tend to use word "Basically" very often...
and there is a difference between pure knowledge and beeing civilized...
because I have seen people with doctorates swear like some kind of sailor from 19th century, and I have seen a simple worker with simply school education to be far more civilized than most of us...

[skullreken]

I don't see the way I talk as being any sort of a hindrance or display of vulgarity and it certainly does not mean that I am unable to conjugate sentences and explain things properly. It's just part of the regional dialect from were I grew up like having an accent.

I work in a department store and 80% of the time I am dealing with customers. The most important thing in my job is to have manners it doesn't matter what your accent or dialect is like as long as you are polite and capable of helping the customers. Despite my way of speaking I have won employee of the month twice and earned a pay rise every year when employee evaluations come up which isn't easy to achieve your management team marks you in 12 categories you need 80% to get a raise.

I'm no stranger to the arts either I was actually going to go to an acting college before I decided medical research was the path in life I wanted to take. I was part of Youth amateur drama association during my teens taking part in plays such as Oliver Twist where I picked up actor of the year, Juno and the Paycock by Sean O'Casey
(if you aren't familiar with his work I would recommend reading it his plays were cutting edge for their time dealing with Socialism Patriotism and Feminism and the repression of sex in socioty at the time, he was the poet W.B Yeats's favourite play write)
and Grease among others Grease involved six months of dancing lessons and singing lessons from people brought in by the drama association

I did ballroom dancing until I was 12 and won a few trophies for myself in competition

I play music. I play the bag pipes and play with former grade 3 world champions St Maur's of Rush this has given me the honour of taking part in London and Moscow's first ever Saint Patrick's day parades. As well as preforming in band competitions I've had success in a number of solo competitions and despite being a French student the German department in my high school invited me on German exchange to give a recital for the Mayor town counsel of Munchberg in Germany

I also play bass in a rock band and have composed a number of songs with my band mates if anyone is interested in hearing a sample of our work here is a link http://www.sendspace.com/file/aps0n4

I also won an award for oration in a debate between my Scout platoon and one from another district at the regional jamboree

My proudest achievement was receiving a bronze Gaisce award from the president of Ireland Mary McAleese it is youth program designed to help teen develop through sport personal skill and community service and testing your ability to work with others through organising a trip away involving a ten mile hike over a weekend. I took Karate lessons and went swimming I worked on honing my piping skills and acting (the singing and dancing lessons for Grease also lent to this) and I volunteered at the local nursing home and took part in organising a camping trip in the Wicklow mountains with other candidates from my locality.

I don't think think that being "cultured" though the arts makes you more educated than the next person and I don't think that how someone talks is a fair way to judge them. To be honest it disgusts me and I see that point of view as being nothing less than pure snobbery that belongs in an episode of Frasier where it should be laughed at!